Vanguard Magazine

16FEBRUARY/MARCH 2025 www.vanguardcanada.com I N T E R V I E W Cdr HUNT: Q: Martin, did you have anything to add on that one? MARTIN DREWS : I do. I think it's critically important you establish that and put that in place, so you hit the ground running. Absolutely. I would suggest also that IT solutions must be easy to use and we must train the peo- ple on how to use it. It's great to deliver something, but if nobody knows how to use it, it's a problem. To my point about you have to hit the ground running, from the very first day that we get these submarines we want to absolutely maintain and understand the material state. We don't want to lose track of where we are in the material state of the submarine. So having that IT system in place to document that from day one is critical in my opinion. If I can just go back to that question about workforce development, because I really think that's important to stress a little bit. One of the things I saw when I was in Australia was that they established long-term contractual relationships with key colleges and universities. I thought that was powerful. In an asset like this, ca- pability goes far beyond just the defence industry. I think we really need to consider those key linkages to those colleges and years. I think it was Paul that mentioned that but it's critical. I hate to quote Navy strategy, but fundamentally maritime na- tions are based on not just a robust navy, but on robust navy and merchant marine academic institutions that support it as a real ecosystem. Cdr HUNT: Q: Did you have anything to add there, Ian? IAN KREPPS: Yeah, It seems every major capital program today develops its own unique, and per- haps somewhat bespoke, integrated data environment (IDE) of some kind. I think getting back to lessons learned, perhaps there's consideration for the existing IDEs or maturity of those IDE-like products that are already in place on existing pro- grams. And perhaps it's not about a data environment that's dedicated to patrol submarines, but a data environment that's enabled and oriented to sustaining the war fighting fleet of the Canadian Navy. So that's a big ask. That's a requirement that crosscuts multiple programs. And get- ting back to stress testing the siloed project management framework that we all have to live in. I'd say that's a challenge that is worth consideration. A single IDE to en- able the sustainment of the RCN fleet. Cdr HUNT: Q: With up to 12 submarines, it will be imperative to have maintenance support on both the east and west coast. Do you think there will be a need to concentrate certain work periods to a specific coast, and can this challenge be overcome with a mobile workforce? PETER KAROUNOS: I think so. Our current workforce is not geographically located where submarine forces or shipyards are anymore. After COVID they've kind of spread around the country in their remote locations. So, putting the right teams together when you need them to fly in or be somewhere for short periods of time to satisfy a mainte- nance requirement or an upkeep or an up- grade, seems to work quite well. It's cost effective. Industry doesn't need a lot of in- frastructure. Before we had like five floors of office space outside of the Washington Navy yard. We're down to two because we've created a flexed workforce to put the right people together to be able to provide maintenance and not be burdened by a lot of infrastructure or having folks in specific locations. The other thing is we have workforce that are part-time. They come in and out. They might be retired or don't really want to work full-time, but they'll come in for a few months here and there and support a submarine effort or entity or a test and evaluation or whatever it might be. So that's another concept to take into consideration. Cdr HUNT: Q: Operational availability is crucial for a successful ISS for submarines. Can you comment on how performance-based contracting can be effectively used to sustain submarines while incorporating guaranteed minimum annual usage or nautical ones? IAN KREPPS: I think performance models first and fore- most are tied to operational data. It's also tied to how you instrument the data and the transactions and the interactions that happen in the maintenance and sustain- ment ecosystem from dockyard, supply chain, and specialist engineering. So, part of it is about instrumenting your digital ecosystem, developing key performance indicators, and over a period of time, de- termining how those KPIs drive an op- erational effect that is seen by the end user. You cannot do that at day zero or day one. It takes a transition period where you allow for that instrumentation. You allow for that data processing. I would say we probably have more time than we think to get the in-service support solu- tion right. And I think moving forward with purpose and with momentum is key but also being patient and not rushing to failure or compromise. So, if you really want to get to a position where you have a performance-based contract, you've got to respect and carve out the necessary time and create the space for acquiring data, analyzing data, and then determin- ing which of those KPIs or performance metrics are driving an operational effect for your customer. Cdr HUNT: That's great. Thank you very much to the four of you for letting me share the stage with you today and giving us some hon- est thoughts about what we're up against today and what we might be up against in the future. "It's not about a data environment that's dedicated to patrol submarines, but a data environment that's enabled and oriented to sustaining the war fighting fleet of the Canadian Navy." — Ian Krepps

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